Hi everyone! I'm new to dog tribe, I love all the pictures and great advice....thanks in advance. so here goes, our dog Peanut is a 9 month old hound mix. We've had him since he was 3 months old. We brought him into our house that already had a now 4 year old Pomeranian/Pekignese named Bear. They get along fabulously now although there was a little tension and posessiveness with Bear in the beginning. Over the past few months Peanut has developed a stealing habit, the little theif! He especially likes our shoes and socks but somedays it includes anything personal he can find like my husbands tools from the garage or a hat or a scarf...etc..... The thing is he doesn't destroy them, which is good, he just takes them into the yard and leaves them in the mud, dirt and rain. He only does this when we go away. He knows it's wrong because when we come home and pick up the items from the yard he is nowhere to be found and when we do find him hiding in the house somewhere, he slinks around and throws himself down on the ground in submissive pose when he sees us holding the object. It seems like a guilty compulsion he has sometimes. We don't punish him, he already knows it's wrong. We've tried redirecting him to good things to play and chew with like toys and bones. We say "don't touch" in a firm voice to the object he's taken and then give him something good and say "good boy, good touch..." and play with him awhile with it. We've also tried just ignoring it. It seems to have gotten slightly better with the frequency of it but sure enough every time we leave for more than a few hours, there is something in the yard. When I've researched this I've only found info on stealing food or trying to play "keep away' with objects. He doesn't do either of these. He is a total sweetie we love him to death and we don't really any other problems besides normal puppy behavior, e.g. learning to not jump on people, etc... I guess I'm wondering if this is something he'll just grow out of. Or maybe it's something to do with he wasn't the first dog here. At first our dog Bear was very posessive with toys and stuff, she definitely didn't want to share. Now she has mellowed out and they play with the same toys regularly (and eachother constantly). Anyways, just throwing it out there to see if anybody has any thoughts?
Thanks!
Thanks!
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Tue, December 4, 2007 - 2:51 PMSounds like a puppy for sure, but a habit you don't want even in the short run.
I had a dog that continued to take things out of the trash. I got the Bitter Apple dog repellant, and broke her from going anywhere near the trash can after about 3 weeks.
and make sure to put out lots of chew toys that are just for the dogs.. then they learn the good things to steal and chew vs. your shoes..
good luck! -
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Tue, December 4, 2007 - 3:55 PMI don't have any advice, but I remember a news story in Boston about 7 months ago where (i think it was a cat, though it may have been a dog - excuse my poor memory), had been stealing from the whole neighbourhood. Her owners found the stash and there were gloves, socks, bras, pants, tools ... the list went on and on! It was amazing what this critter got away with! -
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Wed, December 5, 2007 - 12:16 AMomg, that's hilarious! wow, I guess it could be worse. Hopefully this isn't the first steps in his future life as a neighborhood criminal!
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Wed, December 5, 2007 - 12:22 AMthanks for that advice sunburn. we tried spraying bitter apple on a shoe and left it out once. didn't seem to deter him in the least but I'm thinking we didn't spray it enough or often enough. I'll go back to trying that. and yeah, I think he is just now starting to get the picture about his toys to play with. I just think we might have to really drive that home by playing with him with the toys more often. I'm beginning to think we may have been just impatient, he's such a big dog, I forget he's still a puppy.
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Wed, December 5, 2007 - 1:10 AMThe things he seems to steal have personal scents on them. I think he might just have some separation anxiety. Also he is a puppy.
You may have to start working on the separation part of it. Otherwise when he gets older he will become destructive. Remember alslo
Hounds are working dogs that pick up a scent and follow it. All dogs do it but Hounds are REALLY REALLY Good at it.
You might even have to use Crating once in a while to break him of it.
Good luck. -
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Wed, December 5, 2007 - 12:43 PMtatt, you do you have any recomendations for making the seperation easier. Crating is good but just wondering if there is anything else to try? thanks -
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Wed, December 5, 2007 - 1:29 PMHere are 2 things I'm personally doing right now to lessen my pup's separation anxiety:
* For the first 5-10 minutes after coming home do not greet your dog. Just do what you would normally do if they weren't there (take off your coat, change out of your shoes, put your groceries away, use the restroom, etc...) and do not talk to them in an excited, high pitch "HI! I'm Home! Hi!" kind of way during all of this. The reason is you are rewarding the adrenaline rush that your dog is feeling when you greet them right away (you can also create the dog that always jumps on people coming in the door), which to them is close to euphoria, and if you continue to do so they associate that level of joy with seeing you because it is rewarded. Dogs will associate seeing you/new people with that level of excitement, which can cause them to act out while your gone or get anxious when you leave. Wait until your dog calms down, maybe even gives up, ignores you, walks out of the room, then you greet them calmly.
* Pretend to pack up your stuff (most people are creatures of habit and have the same cues re: leaving the house) so that your dog can feel like "Oh no! They're leaving," but you don't actually go anywhere and it'll calm them so that the next time you actually leave they don't react. For me it's packing up DJ equipment (both me and my sweetie are DJ's) and then walking into the hallway for just a few minutes and coming back and staying for the rest of the night.
I hope these tips work. They seem to be working for us, although now we're working on my fiance taking our dog somewhere without me without her freaking out. Hasn't worked yet. The last 3 times he took her to a friends house without me she paced and paced, puked a couple of times, and even peed in their house (she never does that). To get a dog that is calm in all situations, with or with out you, you have to create those situations for them. I'm also working on not coming home at the same time every day - my dog also seems to be more anxious when I'm not right after work and sometimes I have other things to do after work. -
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Thu, December 6, 2007 - 11:46 AMthis is great advice Tri. I now realize we have been making kind of a big deal of coming and goings from the house. When we get home we greet them, when we leave with them we all get excited. We're definitely on board now with making it a normal, not special event. I'm going to definitely try this all.
We had some problems leaving our smaller dog Bear with other people or with the groomer to get her hair cut. She would scream bloody murder and get all panicky. The only thing I found that helped her is to try my hardest to not have any guilt about leaving her. If I felt guilty and looked back or said anything to her she would freak out more. I learned to show no emotion and just walk out like it was normal and eventually she stopped screaming. Now she doesn't scream or panic. I wouldn't say she likes going to the groomer or boarder but she deals with it much better now. It's funny how much like kids they are, I used to work in daycare and I remember the same thing with the kids being dropped off, the guiltier the parent looked the more the kids screamed. I know it's easier said than done and feeling guilty when your dog is screaming like someone is killing her or getting sick like yours is a normal reaction. I just learned to not show the guilt to her. you also may want to try Bach's remedy rescue in her water anytime your going to do anything too stressfull. We use it occasionally and it's really helped.
Thanks again for your advice and good luck with your pup too!
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Wed, December 5, 2007 - 2:37 PMI agree with the post about not greeting immediately upon arriving home. let them settle down and then greet them calmly and steady voice. reserve the high pitched voice for playing with them.
Teach the dog to live with separation. the more you do it the less anxious they will be when you are gone. basically leave the dog in a room and leave and close the door. count down a minute and then come back. do this several times at a time. meaning practice this for 10 minutes one day.. then increase the amount of time you are out of the room. eventually the dog will not care that you are coming or going. there won't be the need to be near you by stealing the personal items either.
Create a place where your pet is safe. and I do mean SAFE. as in the crate. make sure there are things there that they know belong to THEM! and perhaps one of their own blankets kind of thing. Also NEVER use that space as punishment. once they realize they have a safe haven they will use it. they will go there automatically when you go away so that they know they are home and nothing to worry about.
Crating is such a good way of giving your companion a place to feel safe and you are then able to use the crate for nightime and when guests arrive. Then you have the option of leisurely introducing the people that come in the house. Dogs have a really long memory. ANYONE you introduce as a member of the pack will always be a member. regardless of how long they are gone. with a crate if you do not introduce the person to the dog then when someone comes back that has not been introduced they will not be let in.
I know it sounds mean but this is how it works. The mastiffs that I keep company with are very protective. they can smell the people on the other side of the door and know whether to let them in or not.
I made the mistake once of letting the mastiffs on the couch. Now they own it! and I cannot get a seat on movie nights..
but the image is true... do not let them do anything you do not want them doing in the future. once they are aware that its allowed they will never give that line back. hahahha... like kids testing the limits......
Tatt.
I hope this helps. -
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Thu, December 6, 2007 - 11:55 AMthanks tatt. we're definitely going to work on the seperation aspect of all of this more. We'll work more on reintroducing him to his crate. We have it set up and ready to go, he just doesn't use it as much on his own as he did when he was younger. I like the idea of putting him in safe areas of the house to be alone with his things, and then coming in and out. Thanks for the advice, your mastiffs are beautiful we love them and have thought of getting one in the future when we get a house with a bigger yard. I can see how sharing the couch with those guys is not really an option! -
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Fri, December 7, 2007 - 5:17 PMWe ended up buying a couch for each of them. it was just easier.
Now if we could just have california king beds in every room and one for each of the dogs. Maybe for christmas hahahahahah
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Mon, February 11, 2008 - 8:03 PM1) more exercise
2) less access to forbidden objects. gates/crates/doors, boxes for stuff, etc. (i completely agree that this is normal puppy behaivor AND with NOT allowing this to become even more of a habit by artful intervention now.)
3) more focus on "allowed" toys. Everytime the Bear has something that falls into this category, chase him around, shower him with praise, make a big big deal out of it.
4) Use this routine in an unusual way when you come back to the house after an absence. In the event that he actually thinks that the stolen objects bring you home. . . i would come home, hunt through the house for some "magic " toy (such as his Kong, stuffed full with yummies so as to keep him occupied) and then make a big deal over the TOY as a way to begin your interaction with him. (if you stuff it really well, there will be a tiny tidbit which your human hands can god-like get out for him. Impressive!) (Food toys in double dog households are tricky unless you are sure that there won't be any squabbling while you are gone. so use caution.)
5) set ups - if he does this when you are around, a very quick interruption for the naughty behavior (maybe even followed by a time out). If he only does this when you are gone, you'll have to be crafty with video/webcam/peering into windows/noisemakers etc to "catch him in the act" even though you are presumably gone. . .
By the way, there is no need to show him the muddy stolen shoes. . .most submissive pee/guilty looks are usually a reaction to human demeanor/body language (even if you aren't punishing) rather than to some "memory" of a naughty behavior.
. . . .just a couple ideas off the top of my professional dogtraining (seriously) head.
Hope some of this helps.
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Re: advice on stealing objects?
Tue, February 19, 2008 - 11:54 AMHey Ayn,
Just a couple ideas...do continue to try to have an ample supply of toys for Peanut to play with around. Variety is key there. You can even "rotate" toys by putting some away for a while - a week of two - then pull it back out for regained novelty. Do also try toys that you can stuff with food/cookies/peanut butter such as a Kong or a Triple Crown toy (as long as you don't think it wil cause a fight between the two dogs) that will give him something rewarding to fixate on and help distract him away from worrying about where you guys are (seperation anxiety). I also would recommend not using the same word for positive and negative commands - I think you said something like no bite and good bite. Try "leave it" or something else for dissueding and something simple and super positive like "YES!" for encouraging. Lastly, if it keeps up, crating is always a good idea. Just remember it is not for punishment, but rather forcing the behavior that you seek - such as sleeping and staying out of trouble - which sets him up for success! Feel free to give him a Kong or any super durable toy in the crate as a pacifier.
Good luck!
